SCCT Rating List (25.05.2012)

By Sedat Canbaz Date 2012-05-26 11:48

Btw,i have updated the conditions with more details:

For Better Engine Performance
*MP Engines are played between each other using 6 physical cores
*Perfect 2012b's opening lines are frequently tuned/optimized
*Adapters (Polyglot,Wb2Uci...) are not planning to be used
*Multiply Matches (running several GUIs on same PC) are not allowed
*LIVE Broadcasting Tools (Publish Tournament on WEB) are not allowed
*During Matches:No any external software is running in the background
*It's not installed any programs to tray in the Taskbar (Startup)
*The SCCT Tournament Computers are daily ShutDown
*Internet is disabled as protecting from any kind of threads
*No clicking with mouse,no typing...(when the tourney is active)

SCCT Rating's Disadvantages
*Chess Engines are played with Ponder OFF (NON-Auto232 mode)
*Some opening lines of Perfect 2012b book still needs optimization
*Blitz time control has been used (not many high-quality games)
*For more reliable rating, more engines and games are needed
*No LIVE Broadcasting (external PC and webcam is missing)

SCCT Rating's Advantages
*Engines are played with same time control on latest fast machines
*64 bit / SSE Engine versions have been played,using 6 physical cores
*It's true that Ponder ON is better for Chess Engines,but note also that:
-Ponder OFF 6 core is approx. 140 Elo stronger than Ponder ON 1 core
*During matches:no external software is running (e.g LIVE tools or several GUIs...)
*As far as possible, the strongest modern openings are preferred and used

Time Control
*All games are played with same time control: 3 Minutes/Game + 2 Seconds/Move
*One of the most preferable blitz time controls, used in latest Chess Championships
*The overall time duration game length:equals to average 11 minutes per game
*Personally I'm not a big fan testing the engines with fast time controls
*Blitz games are less important and the results cannot be taken as very seriously
*But however, blitz is the most used and played time control in chess
*The main reason i use this blitz time control for the current rating is very simple:
-As a single tester,I have no enough free cpu time to create a reliable slow rating
*Plus blitz chess offers more possibilities to test many different engine versions

For more details:
http://www.sedatcanbaz.com/chess/2838-2/

Best Wishes,
Sedat

By Sedat Canbaz Date 2012-05-29 00:58

New Engine Update:
Ivanhoe B46fE.02

More games are needed for better conclusion

But however,Ivanhoe B46fE.02 x64 seems to be a very strong compile

As we see, the current Ivanhoe B46fE.02 results are impressive so far

My Congratulations to Ivanhoe team and Izak Pretorius!

For Current Standings:
http://www.sedatcanbaz.com/chess/scct-rating/

Best Regards,
Sedat

By Stefan Pohl Date 2012-05-29 12:28

[quote="Sedat Canbaz"]
New Engine Update:
Ivanhoe B46fE.02

More games are needed for better conclusion

But however,Ivanhoe B46fE.02 x64 seems to be a very strong compile

As we see, the current Ivanhoe B46fE.02 results are impressive so far

My Congratulations to Ivanhoe team and Izak Pretorius!

For Current Standings:
http://www.sedatcanbaz.com/chess/scct-rating/

Best Regards,
Sedat
[/quote]

Alles nur statistische Schwankung. Ich habe diese Version für meine TEB-Liste durchlaufen lassen (3000 Partien!). Sie wurde nicht gelistet, weil sie 0.5% schlechter gescort hat, als die schon gelistete 46h-Version (auch ein PeterPan-Compile). Das zeigt mal wieder sehr schön, daß selbst knapp 160 Partien eben nicht reichen, um ein aussagekräftiges Ranking einer Engineversion zu erhalten.
Tja, deswegen teste ich mit 60'+750ms auf nur einem Core. Da laufen dann 4 Partien simultan und ich schaffe die 3000 Partien (jede dauert etwa 4 Minuten) in etwa 50 Stunden.

Gruß - Stefan

By Sedat Canbaz Date 2012-05-29 18:41

[quote="Stefan Pohl"]
[quote="Sedat Canbaz"]
New Engine Update:
Ivanhoe B46fE.02

More games are needed for better conclusion

But however,Ivanhoe B46fE.02 x64 seems to be a very strong compile

As we see, the current Ivanhoe B46fE.02 results are impressive so far

My Congratulations to Ivanhoe team and Izak Pretorius!

For Current Standings:
http://www.sedatcanbaz.com/chess/scct-rating/

Best Regards,
Sedat
[/quote]

Alles nur statistische Schwankung. Ich habe diese Version für meine TEB-Liste durchlaufen lassen (3000 Partien!). Sie wurde nicht gelistet, weil sie 0.5% schlechter gescort hat, als die schon gelistete 46h-Version (auch ein PeterPan-Compile). Das zeigt mal wieder sehr schön, daß selbst knapp 160 Partien eben nicht reichen, um ein aussagekräftiges Ranking einer Engineversion zu erhalten.
Tja, deswegen teste ich mit 60'+750ms auf nur einem Core. Da laufen dann 4 Partien simultan und ich schaffe die 3000 Partien (jede dauert etwa 4 Minuten) in etwa 50 Stunden.

Gruß - Stefan
[/quote]

All statistical fluctuation only. I can run this version on my list TEB (3000 games!).
She was not listed because they have scored 0.5% lower than those already listed 46h version (also a PeterPan-compile).
This just goes very well that even rich almost 160 games not just to get a meaningful ranking of an engine version.
Well, that's why I'm testing with 60 '+750 ms on a single core.
Since then 4 games running simultaneously and I make the 3000 games (each lasting about 4 minutes) in about 50 hours.

Greetings - Stefan

Dear Stefan,

Thanks for your interest...

Agreed with you....170 games are not enough data and as i mentioned before we need more games for better conclusion

And the current winning performance of Ivanhoe B46fE.02 is 72% (after 283 games)-still very good !

About your results-0.5% lower than those already listed 46h
Ivanhoe B46fE.02 is the latest compile by Izak and as far as possible i prefer to test the latest engine versions
And its quite normal to see different results,due to mostly of are testing the engines at different conditions
I mean,any engine performance is highly effected from different factors (e.g hardware,single or many cores,opening books,time control vs...)

Lieber Stefan,

Danke für Ihr Interesse ...

Mit Ihnen vereinbarten .... 170 Spiele sind nicht genug Daten und wie ich bereits erwähnt, bevor wir noch mehr Spiele für bessere Abschluss brauchen

Und die aktuellen Gewinnzahlen Leistung von Ivanhoe B46fE.02 beträgt 72% (nach 283 Spielen)-immer noch sehr gut!

Über Ihre ergebnisorientierte 0,5% niedriger als der bereits genannten 46h
Ivanhoe B46fE.02 ist die neueste Kompilierung von Izak und so weit wie möglich Ich bevorzuge die neuesten Engine-Versionen testen
Und seine ganz normal zu unterschiedlichen Ergebnissen, vor allem aufgrund von zu sehen sind, die Prüfung der Motoren bei unterschiedlichen Bedingungen
Ich meine, ist jede Leistung des Motors stark von verschiedenen Faktoren erfolgt (zB Hardware, Einzel-oder viele Kerne, Eröffnung Bücher, Zeitsteuerung vs ..)

Btw,i used Google translator-i hope its ok

Best,
Sedat

By Sedat Canbaz Date 2012-05-30 01:11 Edited 2012-05-30 01:21

Zitat:

Da laufen dann 4 Partien simultan

Eine Sache mehr,

Ich las, dass Sie mehrere Spiele am gleichen PC?
Hmm ... aus meiner Erfahrung kann ich sagen (im Fall von mehreren Übereinstimmungen auf demselben PC) einige Motoren derzeit mit voller Kraft spielen

Mehrere Spiele am gleichen PC ist nicht sehr gute Idee, es ist ein Nachteil für die Schach-Engines
Ich meine, können die externen Software (während der Spiele) ernstzunehmender Faktor, wo die Leistung des Motors bewirkt werden kann (nicht zu Gunsten für Motoren) sein

Beachten Sie auch, dass für eine bessere Leistung des Motors (bei SCCT Spiele): keine beliebige externe Software ausgeführt wird (zB LIVE-Tools oder mehrere GUIs ...)

------------------------------

One thing more,

I read that you are running multiple matches on same PC ?
Hmm...from my experience i can say (in case of running multiple matches on same PC ) some engines dont play at full strength

Multiple matches on same PC is not very good idea,its a disadvantage for chess engines
I mean,the external softwares (during matches) can be serious factor, where the engine's performance can be effected (not in favor for engines)

Note also that for better engine performance (during SCCT matches):no any external software is running (e.g LIVE tools or several GUIs...)

Greetings,
Sedat

By Stefan Pohl Date 2012-05-30 10:09

[quote="Sedat Canbaz"]

Hmm...from my experience i can say (in case of running multiple matches on same PC ) some engines dont play at full strength

Multiple matches on same PC is not very good idea,its a disadvantage for chess engines
I mean,the external softwares (during matches) can be serious factor, where the engine's performance can be effected (not in favor for engines)

Note also that for better engine performance (during SCCT matches):no any external software is running (e.g LIVE tools or several GUIs...)

Greetings,
Sedat
[/quote]

The LittleBlitzerGUI is the only running software and only one time. LittleBlitzerGUI allows 1 game per core (no ponder) up to 16 games/cores. And it shows the average nodes per second of all engines in the tournament. Everything OK (related to nodes per second displayed by the FritzGUI for all used engines (there running alone)).

Best- Stefan

By Sedat Canbaz Date 2012-05-30 13:11

[quote="Stefan Pohl"]
[quote="Sedat Canbaz"]

Hmm...from my experience i can say (in case of running multiple matches on same PC ) some engines dont play at full strength

Multiple matches on same PC is not very good idea,its a disadvantage for chess engines
I mean,the external softwares (during matches) can be serious factor, where the engine's performance can be effected (not in favor for engines)

Note also that for better engine performance (during SCCT matches):no any external software is running (e.g LIVE tools or several GUIs...)

Greetings,
Sedat
[/quote]

The LittleBlitzerGUI is the only running software and only one time. LittleBlitzerGUI allows 1 game per core (no ponder) up to 16 games/cores. And it shows the average nodes per second of all engines in the tournament. Everything OK (related to nodes per second displayed by the FritzGUI for all used engines (there running alone)).

Best- Stefan
[/quote]

I never used LittleBlitzerGUI,but i tested almost all rest Chess GUIs

And what i noticed during my testings, when running several GUIs (multiple matches;1 core;ponder on):
-many games lost on time
-crashes
-lower processor speed (tested by Fritz Benchmark)

Here are the testings,where i used several GUIs:
http://www.sedatcanbaz.com/chess/chess-guis-test/
http://www.sedatcanbaz.com/chess/ratings/scct-auto232/
http://www.sedatcanbaz.com/chess/scct-sse-no-sse/

I dont say exactly 100 % that the reason of those all bugs are the multiple matches
But however,i noticed that some of the engines suffer from multiple matches

And I strongly believe (for ideal chess performance):no any external software should be used in the system process

Best Regards,
Sedat

By Sedat Canbaz Date 2012-05-30 23:17

More Ivanhoe B46fE.02 x64 6c games are added

The current Ivanhoe version's start was impressive (up to 200 games),but unfortunately was not so lucky in the last 250 games

But however,as a freeware engine-very good results !

For SCCT Rating List:
http://www.sedatcanbaz.com/chess/scct-rating/

Kind Regards,
Sedat

By Stefan Pohl Date 2012-05-31 12:16

[quote="Sedat Canbaz"]

I never used LittleBlitzerGUI,but i tested almost all rest Chess GUIs

And what i noticed during my testings, when running several GUIs (multiple matches;1 core;ponder on):
-many games lost on time
-crashes
-lower processor speed (tested by Fritz Benchmark)

[/quote]

Try the LittleBlitzerGUI and forget the rest (Chess GUIs) !!!
All of your problems (-many games lost on time,-crashes,-lower processor speed (tested by Fritz Benchmark))
will no longer exist.

Thats why the LittleBlitzerGUI is the only GUI which is working when you want to play 1 game per core, which is the only fast solution for engine-testing today...

With the LittleBlitzerGUI I played more than 30000 games without any crash(!!!) and with all engines working with full speed (referring to FritzGUI/benchmark).

Greetings - Stefan

By Sedat Canbaz Date 2012-06-01 00:18 Edited 2012-06-01 00:26

Thank you for your recommendation

Normally i am quite satisfied with the current SCCT conditions,but anyway later i will check it

I never tried LittleBlitzerGUI and i wonder about some options:
-Can i test the MP engines using maximum cores against each other,i mean at 6 cores (not 1 core);ponder off ?
-Can i use my Perfect books under this GUI or it allows to use only opening database (starting positions) ?

Best,
Sedat

By Stefan Pohl Date 2012-06-01 06:01

[quote="Sedat Canbaz"]
Thank you for your recommendation

Normally i am quite satisfied with the current SCCT conditions,but anyway later i will check it

I never tried LittleBlitzerGUI and i wonder about some options:
-Can i test the MP engines using maximum cores against each other,i mean at 6 cores (not 1 core);ponder off ?
-Can i use my Perfect books under this GUI or it allows to use only opening database (starting positions) ?

Best,
Sedat
[/quote]

First:Yes. (Corenumber must be set with specific UCI-command of the engine).Ponder is not possible in LittleBlitzerGUI
Second:No. Only starting-positions (PGN) are working and only in gauntlet mode (in round robin the position will chosen randomly). Books are not supported (only engine-specific books).

Stefan

By Sedat Canbaz Date 2012-06-01 09:21

Thank you for your replay dear Stefan

Ok...maybe later i will try LittleBlitzerGUI
And in case of any LittleBlitzer configuration,i will need your help

I wonder about Fruit 090705 results,i mean we will see forfeits on time or not (if i run Fruit 090705 under LittleBlitzer)

Because Fruit 090705 (tested under Fritz/ShredderGUIs) has several games lost no time

Best,
Sedat