aufhänger ist das CCC von den gründern FÜR die Programmierer gegründet wurde.
Auch enduser durften mitsprechen.
Es wurde damals festgelegt das keine kommerzielle Einflußnahme,
auch nicht des Site-Inhabers erlaubt sei. Auch kein Link vom Forum in den Shop des Besitzers.
Das war elementar wichtig. CCC sollte den Computerschach-Mitgliedern gehören und
auch über demokratische Wahlen von ihnen geleitet werden.
Nun ist das Forum von kommerziellen interessenträgern und deren Wasserträgern übernommen worden.
Das ist keine große Überraschung.
Kommerzielle Firmen benutzen Foren, wollen Märkte für ihre Interessen manipulieren.
bedienen sich spezieller Wasserträger, das sind naive Schreiber die alles machen
was der Boß ihnen so vorschreibt.
Die haben CCC nun übernommen, zensieren und bannen Mitglieder nach eigenem
gusto. Mischen sich auch inhaltlich in die Belange ein.
2 sehr gute Postings von Chris Whittington und Ed Schröder, beide ehemals Gründerväter von
CCC, geben über diesen Putsch der Kommerziellen und ihrer Wasserträger, Auskunft:
Zitat:
Re: its a sad thing that CCC dies this way...
by Chris Whittington » Wed Jun 09, 2010 6:35 pm
When we created CCC in 1997 it was an absolute condition that the shop (ICDCHESS) and the owner (Steven Schwartz) had absolutely no influence at all on the forum, its management or operation. There were no links allowed from the forum back to the shop and the shop/ICD was to be treated at arms length, just like like any other commercial operating in the computer chess business. Steve Schwartz application to be a member of the Founder Group was rejected by the Founder Group and the FG negotiated with him via his agent, Enrique Irazoqui.
Clearly it was a mistake to have had the site on the shop's server because, over the years, the shop has indeed interfered in forum policy and has attempted, more or less successfully to influence moderators. The current method of influence is via the Site Admin, Sam Hull, who effectively operates as a kind of super-moderator.
The original intent of the Founder Group was that the forum be owned, run and controlled by the computer chess community itself, and certainly not by any shop/business operating in the field.
I regret that the democratic forum we set up has been subverted in this way. Obviously there is a need in any industry for a forum and it is vitally important that forum be fully independent. CCC has failed in that regard.
und Ed Schröder:
Zitat:
Re: its a sad thing that CCC dies this way...
by Rebel » Thu Jun 10, 2010 11:00 am
The Founders Group of CCC made a crucial mistake one year after the creation of CCC back in 1997. They decided to dissolve because CCC was running smoothly and they were confident CCC was in good hands by ICD together with the mods (being the representatives of the members of CCC) mainly members of the Founders Group in those early days. As such they lost control over the forum.
While the years went by things slowly changed, the introduction of CTF, the shift in moderation teams moving from Founder Group members to end-users, but last but not least the retirement of Steve Schwartz handing over ICD to the new owner Quentin.
It was on this point things started to go the wrong way. The new ICD decided to attract a site-administrator (SA) to clean-up the polluted member list. While actually the idea was fine the result wasn't. The SA (without communicating with the mods) started to decide who was accepted and who was rejected to enter the forum. This was a clear breach of the original set-up of the Founder Group of CCC, crucial decisions like these are the authorization for the representatives of the members of CCC (the democratic elected mods) only, not by the SA who was installed by ICD and not democratically chosen at all.
The mods at that time are hardly to blame, most of them weren't aware of the Founding Principles of 1997, no interference of ICD, the forum was run by its members who twice a years chose their new leaders. So when the SA spoke in the name of ICD they listened, no big surprise here. The blame is on the Founder Group for giving up control as keepers and watchers of their brainchild.
Things went worse when the SA started to interfere with moderator decisions, a receipt for disaster. Various tries by CCC members to get back CCC on its roots again failed. And now there is this terrible clone issue that has split CCC once again.
My advice to CCC: re-install a kind of oversight group of 3 experienced and wise people who clean-up CCC and in case of big future trouble have the power to change things. Old-timers like Bob, Chris, Enrique come to mind. The oversight group keeps a very low profile and only interferes when there is big trouble, such as now, mods who clash.
Regards,
Ed
Ich denke nicht das die Übernahme durch die Kommerziellen und ihrer Wasserträger reversibel ist.
Das Dingen ist mausetot.
Zuletzt hat ein unbekannter Programmierer
Bob Hyatts und weiterer Leutes Austritt aus dem CCC als "Kollateralschaden"
bezeichnet, und anderen Leuten noch persönlich Tschüß gesagt.
Solche Leute sind m.E. der Grund warum Computerschach sich zu dem entwickelt,
was wir in letzter Zeit sehen.
Es geht nicht mehr um die Computerschachinhalte, sondern die Inhalte werden von Interessengruppen
gelenkt und benutzt um eitle Interessen durchzusetzen.
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